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Talentus
Provost
Posts:123
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| 07/11/2006 11:35 AM |
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| how does a compromise sound, 40 minutes paired, then 40 minutes alone. winner will be determined by the best over wins/loss*total number fought? |
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Talentus "Talon" del Albero |
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Gemma~
Provost
Posts:97
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| 07/11/2006 12:07 PM |
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the forum ate my reply. Arg.
The gist was: as a cadet I used Cadet Tournaments to guage where I was within the pool of fighters in An Tir. Oftentimes, we would travel 10+ hours to attend Crown level tournaments for the opportunity to fight in a format to allows your own personal skills and prowess to shine, team formats do not allow this. As well, they are oft times messy or sloppy. As a cadet, I would have sorely missed to CTs, and may have thought about not making the trek if they were not offered.
As a OWS member, I use them to guage where people are, use them to meet new people, use them to make informed decisions/opinions/observations of potential cadets/potential OWS candidates, see who's improved, see who's fallen apart, and as a forum to offer help or instruction if I am able. The CTs offer the OWS yet another tool to succeed in furthering the rapier communities members, it is a valuable format.
To address the "too shy to approach an OWS member" - all of our contact info (for the most part anyway) is online in the OWS lounge...if you are too shy to approach us directly, contact us offline and start a discussion there.
2 pence,
Gemma~
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jgreywolf
Hai Gioco?
Posts:685
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| 07/11/2006 12:19 PM |
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Doesn't sound like a compromise. Still not a cadet tourney. Still seen as gimmicky, I would think.
BTW - I would like to point out that a cadet tourney, or ven an Open Field tourney, does NOT have a winner. We (the OWS) will recognize certain individuals for things like, most fights, best ratio, and most wins - but there is no real "winner".
That is another missing lately. Traditionally a representative of the OWS would work with the lists folks to tally up the results, and then all of the rapier fighters would get together to hear the results, some people would talk about specific fights or actions that really stuck out for them, etc. There are a lot of good things that used to go on at Kingdom events for the Rapier Community which held some sway over our relationships and connections to each other. Quite a few of those were in some way related to the cadet tourneys.
Think about this, which I find very interesting (Whether it is coincidence or not, or due to some other factor, is not a question that we can answer at the monent I just find it interesting):
As the "open field" tournament format (ie, "non-exclusive") increased in frequency at Crown Level events, displacing the "restricted" cadet tourney format, you can also see a decrease in the "family" environment that Rapier Community had previously enjoyed. It also seems as if the active members of the OWS started to "thin" around this time as well.
It's Ironic, really. If you look at the the changes over this time period (roughly last 4-5 years) this really stands out.
I hear complaints that the rapier community is disjointed, fractionalized, regionalized, and other words that end in -ed. Some people feel dis-connected to the larger rapier community. You can also hear those that feel the WS are not fulfilling their role as leaders within the community.
And yet, event after event, year after year, there seems to be a direct effort not to allow a simple activity that I really feel was one of the sources of everything that is missing now.
Yes. That is Irony.
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Justin Greywolf (SCA: Ramon Diaz de la Vega)
Director
Old World Martial Arts - Teaching Historical Italian Swordplay in the Pacific Northwest |
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Luciano
Provost
Posts:145
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| 07/11/2006 12:43 PM |
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One concern I have with the pairs tournament is space. Fighting with a partner takes more space. Lately, we've barely had room for single fights without bumping into people. So unless you have a really big field available, people will either be bumping into each other, or standing on the sides waiting for space to fight. And I know nothing irritates a fighter more than having to wait to fight. 
Also, I think the pairs tournament works better in a double elim format, instead of an open field format. It allows people the ability to use a bit more strategy and tactics instead of the get in fight and get out mentality of open field tournaments.
Luciano
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Talentus
Provost
Posts:123
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| 07/11/2006 1:45 PM |
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Because of space concerns and i want the most people to have the most fun, chance are very good that the open tourney on saturday will become a traditional open/cadet style tourney 
So please come out and fight, it will be mucho funo (my bi-lingual skills totally coming through there )
There will be a prize the for the winner of the "token" double elimination tourney on Sunday. |
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Talentus "Talon" del Albero |
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Richard
Provost
Posts:84
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| 07/11/2006 3:49 PM |
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Huray! I'm all for fun and mucho fun is mucho funner!
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Sebastien
Has a lot to say...
Posts:208
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| 07/11/2006 4:50 PM |
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Tough decision Talon but I think you made the rigth one. And I thank you for doing so.
I would like to try the format you laid out at some other tourney though. Could be very fun.
Damn I wish I could be there this weekend. |
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Sebastien de Caen
There is no kill like overkill. |
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Dormouse
Provost
Posts:113
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| 07/11/2006 6:05 PM |
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Posted By jgreywolf on 07-11-2006 10:36 AM
BTW - where does our Kingdom Rapier Champion fit in this? He is not scarfed.
Cheers!
Don Ramon de la Vega
Well Ramon, it leaves him with every other unscarved fighter, obviously...
Dormouse |
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I humble myself before God, and there the list ends.
--- Maj. Gen. Sam Houston (The Alamo 2004) |
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Talentus
Provost
Posts:123
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| 07/11/2006 7:23 PM |
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| Agreed, i myself am a big fan of no double standards... |
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Talentus "Talon" del Albero |
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KitH
Free Scholar
Posts:65
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| 07/12/2006 8:53 AM |
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Talentus,
I think you're making the right decision with the traditional open tournament.
I also think that the pairs tourney could be a good thing as an additional tournament. If I remember it right, we did something similar at September Crown 2002 and that was pretty fun. |
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Kit Heinrichs
SCA: Christopher MacEveny, Cadet to Don Magnus von Bremen |
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jgreywolf
Hai Gioco?
Posts:685
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| 07/12/2006 3:14 PM |
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Talentus - I just have one clarifying question for you:
Is this going to be an "Open Field" tourney, or is it going to be a Cadet's tourney? Trust me, you have plenty of support from the community for the latter. ;)
Besides, it could be a nice way to signal a change in possibility for the Rapier Community. Especially since there will be a Cadet Tourney held every year (from now on) at May Crown, July Coronation and September Crown. Obviously there are other things to do at 12th Night. Like, hang out and chat, eat food, sleep, watch TV, sleep... ;)
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Justin Greywolf (SCA: Ramon Diaz de la Vega)
Director
Old World Martial Arts - Teaching Historical Italian Swordplay in the Pacific Northwest |
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Guillemin
Provost
Posts:120
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| 07/13/2006 1:56 PM |
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Wow, I missed this thread completely. Now I know where the 'unapproachable' thread came from.
In my mind, fighting is fighting, even if it is 2 on 2. I applaud the attempt to shake things up a bit. When you have three other Kingdom level events a year where you can test your skill in one-on-one combat in a Cadet's tournament with 60 people in the list, you can afford to sacrifice the one to try something new (pleeeease don't mention travel distance as a reply to this, as I don't wanna go on a rant). And I'm sure there will be ample time to pick fights with whomever you so choose to gauge where you are.
And if you wanted one-on-one, you could have made the short trip north for Quad War, where we had a single elim tournament with a cool sword as the prize. Aak my Don, it's real nice.  |
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Guillemin de Rouen
Cadet to Raoul Delaroche
Rapier Champion of Avacal |
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