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Guillemin
Provost
Posts:120
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| 04/11/2007 10:09 AM |
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Hello all,
Want to present a situation and the two arguments resulting from it. When legged, Fighter A decides to sit, and orients himself with blade extended at an angle with his opponent. Essentially, he's sitting so as to minimize target area and keep the opponent at range. It's somewhat difficult to describe, but many fighters fo this, so I imagine people know where I'm going.
Fighter B wants to use an off-line attack to her advantage. She has 45 degrees in either direction to move and not be corkscrewing her opponent. She moves to her right (Fighter A's left) in order to set up an attack. The question: Can Fighter A re-orient himself (ie. move with her) to keep his blade aligned with her and his torso a smaller target, or must he remain in place? If no, it becomes awkward for Fighter B to fight from the new angle, as she can't move any farther to the right without corkscrewing her opponent. If yes, Fighter B can still perform the desired attack, but must step during the attack instead of setting it up beforehand.
The rules seem, to me, to prohibit this type of movement, but is this rule applicable to kneeling only? 1.6.9.c: Kneeling or sitting fighters may not rise off the ground or their own feet.
a. A fighter kneeling on one knee shall not move forward or backwards on the other leg. Once
legged, a fighter shall remain in place.
If re-orienting is not allowed, why is a fighter allowed to choose his/her facing immediately after taking a shot? Should they not fall in whatever position they find themselves in, compromised or not? |
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Guillemin de Rouen
Cadet to Raoul Delaroche
Rapier Champion of Avacal |
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CM_Unger
Provost
Posts:84
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| 04/11/2007 12:46 PM |
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I'll start by apologizing to Guillamin for circling to your far left a few weeks back. that was very unchivalric of me and I feel really bad.
Having said that, and not having my rule book infront of me I'll try to get this right.
(This is how I understand the rules to mean, not how I'd like them to be)
a fighters FCE is defined as a line extending through thier shoulders to make a 180 degree arc. (or a line)
when legged, a fighters engagement area is a 45 degree arc on both sides of an imaginary line perpendicular to thier FCE (making a 90 degree arc) -- this would be 45 degrees from a line through thier sternum
in melee a fighter is allowed to change his facing -- as this is specifically stated in the melee section, I would argue that you are not be able to change facing in non-melee (single combat)
by the letter of the rule a fighter standing can move anywhere in the 90 degree arc.
(my opinion, having had it be pointed out to me, is that it is very poor form to circle to the fighters off-hand side. they are already at a disadvantage, what more do you want. I now view this along the same line as standing outside a legged fighters measure and picking at them)
so in quick summary
- a legged figheter can not change facing
- though allowed, you shouldn't attack from your opponent's off-hand side (unless they present it to you as thier preferred side)
I know I am not the only one that would like to see this rule adapted to allow a fighter to define their center line when legged and than have 45 degrees both sides of that line. BUT, that is not the rule so we do the best with the rule as it sits. don't abuse the rules.
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Utgar the Mad
Provost
Posts:104
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| 04/12/2007 5:21 PM |
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On the FCE thing I beleive your absolutely correct... my only comment is that if I allow myself to get legged and you want to stand out of my range (which is easy since Im a short sword user) and take shots its up to me to suck you in closer.
I wouldnt call anyone unchivalric for takeing a safer route to killing me unless they clearly abuse the spirit of the rules, Flicking at the hands with a fishingpole like movement or soemthgin similar comes to mind, staying out of range of my weapon while killing me does not.
If you leg me and stay out of range its up to me to coax you in by making you work to reach me IE leaning back a little at a time to bring you closer then moving the torso only forward quickly to close distance once your close enough (not easy but it does work on some)
Anyway I think if you setup to be edge on to me and dont like me moving to the safer side to take you then next time protect your legs better.... I mean isnt that the point of me legging you? to limit your mobility and give myself an advantage???
Peace
Utgar |
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CM_Unger
Provost
Posts:84
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| 04/12/2007 9:26 PM |
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| I think we are rapidly apprioaching teh line that separates what is 'allowed' to be done and what 'shuold' be done.
many people have divergent ideas on ettiquite and so forth.
(I'll start a new thread for views on what should be done)
I welcome more hard rules discussion to continue here. |
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KitH
Free Scholar
Posts:65
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| 04/19/2007 1:48 PM |
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| I remember running into that situation a few years ago. After my opponent moved I asked him if he'd like his current sword position to be the centerline of his FCE. When he responded yes we went forward from that point. |
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Kit Heinrichs
SCA: Christopher MacEveny, Cadet to Don Magnus von Bremen |
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